EXOSOMES IN SKINCARE with Founder Dr. Greg Maguire Of NeoGenesis

[Intro] Hey, everyone. Welcome to Facially Conscious. I'm Trina Renea, a medically-trained Master Esthetician here in Los Angeles, and I'm sitting with my rockstar co-host, Dr. Vicki Rapaport, a board-certified dermatologist with practices in Beverly Hills and Culver City, Rebecca Gadberry, our resident skincare scientist and regulatory and marketing expert, and Julie Falls, our educated consumer who is here to represent you. 

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01:25 Trina Renea: Good morning, everybody, and welcome to Facially Conscious. I'm Trina, esthetician, and I'm here with Julie Falls, our very educated consumer and Dr. Vicki Rapaport, our dermatologist. We are so excited to be with you today and talk about some upcoming technology that we've been kind of talking about, but now we have a super professional coming on with us.

And Dr. Vicki, can you please introduce our episode?

01:55 Dr. Vicki Rapaport: Oh, 100%. Hi, everybody.

01:59 Julie Falls: Hello. This is exciting. 

02:00 Dr. Vicki Rapaport: Good morning, everybody. So today, I'm going to tell you a little bit about Greg Maguire and his company NeoGenesis, and we are going to talk about some of the coolest things in medicine which are called exosomes. If you haven't heard about them, you will.

So I want to tell you a little bit about Dr. Maguire. He is a co-founder of NeoGenesis and he is author of numerous peer-reviewed science publications and three books. He is former professor at UC San Diego School of Medicine and a Fulbright scholar at the National Institutes of Health, pretty cool. And he holds numerous patents on stem cell-based technologies.

This is what we're going to be discussing today, stem cell-based technologies, exosomes in skin care to clarify the confusion out there or just to educate you for the first time.

So, welcome Dr. Maguire.

02:55 Dr. Greg Maguire: Thank you. It's great to be here. I look forward to helping to educate our audience.

03:01 Dr. Vicki Rapaport: Where are we talking to you from? Are you in San Diego now?

03:04 Dr. Greg Maguire: I'm in San Diego, California, beautiful Saturday morning. I'm at my laboratory this morning working on some cool new projects, which always excites me.

03:15 Dr. Vicki Rapaport: Real dedicated scientist on Saturday morning at his lab. It sounds like me. Or it sounds like our prior guest as well, but welcome again. So nice to see you.

03:23 Dr. Greg Maguire: Yeah, I'm a nerd and I'm a geek and I just love being in the lab, so here I am.

03:28 Julie Falls: Love the dedication.

03:30 Trina Renea: So tell us how you came upon exosomes. Like where did you start your research? How did it become?

03:43 Dr. Greg Maguire: The concept that I work with in our technology, our core technology is using a system therapeutic. That means using many molecules to help ameliorate a condition, not just one molecule. And what we're trying to achieve is a renormalization of the physiology. As we age, as we have various disease states, afflicted with traumatic wounds, for example, the physiology goes awry and many pathways become dysfunctional, and so we're trying to return into the skin. 

I also work in the CNS. I was training as a CNS scientist and biophysicist, but we work in the brain doing similar things. But when you are putting the molecules into the skin, we're trying to renormalize the pathways. That includes renormalizing the immune systems in the skin. You need an adaptive immune system. 

So all of this began to be learned by me working with some astounding professors at University of California Berkeley. That's where I really started my physiological renormalization. That was due to Jimmy Allison who won the Nobel Prize in physiology or medicine for renormalizing the immune system in treating cancer.

Then when I got to be a professor at University of California San Diego years later, I started working with stem cells. I had the opportunity to work at one of the great stem cell centers at UCSD and we began to use stem cells to treat the brain.

But, interestingly, the stem cell types we were using, we were actually genetically modifying them. It's very intricate work. But the low down is we were using stem cells derived from the skin to heal the brain. It dawned on me to if these stem cells are working on the brain, I bet they work better on the skin.

So we started working on the skin. And like the brain, which is such a beautiful intricate structure, I self-learned about the skin. The skin is just this beautiful structure, this beautiful immune system, all kinds of stem cells that normally operate in the skin, so I fell in love with the skin. 

And so I work mostly in the skin. I published some more brain science last year, late last year. So I still do work there but my love right now is the skin.

So it was really the work at UC Berkeley and then at UCSD that really led me. I had no idea I was going to go on this pathway, but when you're doing experiments it often takes you through this tortuous path. I eventually landed in the skin and we were healing the skin in wounded conditions.

But interestingly, so you can imagine these molecules that we use from the stem cell, we're using the molecules that stem cells release to heal the brain and heal the skin tissue. And you can well imagine, everyone, if you have an open wound, it's easy to have these molecules penetrate into the tissue and have their healing effect. 

But what we began to see was that these molecules would actually penetrate through the adjacent intact skin. That is the skin that had an intact barrier. And we were a little befuddled because, you know, Dr. Rapaport when I learned, when I taught graduate students, medical students, we learned about globular proteins and how they couldn't penetrate the skin. And here we were having good effect in intact skin.

That led us to question how is it we're achieving this penetration through natural barrier? And eventually, and it wasn't my work but other people's work where they were looking and discovering these extracellular vesicles and particularly exosomes that are a smaller version of the extracellular vesicles. That's what the stem cells are releasing and that has been now shown in human skin studies as a mechanism for how these molecules can penetrate the skin.

So the exosomes have become very important not only for skin science and skin therapeutics but the whole drug delivery world, the science and technologists and drug delivery are very attuned to what's going on with exosomes.

I can delve into that if we wish, but because there's some really important mechanisms that exosomes have, everyone I think out there in the audience will know about liposomes. They're small, little, fat capsules that active ingredients are put into to help penetrate the skin. The exosomes they're better constructed and they have…

08:54 Trina Renea: So exosomes are a delivery system like a liposome.

08:57 Dr. Greg Maguire: Yeah, like the liposome. Yeah, they're a delivery system like the liposome but they also had other qualities that the liposomes don't. So they're very much protecting the molecules inside the exosome and they're actually proteins inside the exosome that protect other proteins and fix them, repair them.

And then on the outside of the exosome, unlike a liposome, are a lot of tethered, attached proteins, polysaccharides, complex sugars that impart upon the exosome the ability to target dysfunctional tissue and, importantly, the ability to penetrate through barriers unlike the liposome.

So I call the exosome a smart liposome.

09:53 Dr. Vicki Rapaport: And are exosomes always good?

09:57 Dr. Greg Maguire: Well, it depends on the tissue from which they originate, because you can take an exosome to a lot of cells in the body, and throughout nature a lot of cells release exosomes or extracellular vesicles. This will be true of cancer cells as well. So if you were to derive exosomes from a cancer cell, then you can transmit cancerous signals.

So one has to be very careful in the cells that you choose to derive the exosomes so you have good therapeutic effect as well as a great safety profile.

10:37 Julie Falls: I'm already seeing tons of products mostly on Instagram. Serums with exosomes, it's becoming a very new buzz word. Not FDA-approved yet? Is that correct?

10:54 Dr. Greg Maguire: Well, some will be in the future. There are drug companies working on approvals to use exosomes to deliver various compounds. But a lot of us work under the FDA's cosmetic guidelines. And so if you use this material without making claims to treat a disease or without making claims to change structure or function, then the FDA definitely allows us to use these.

11:29 Dr. Vicki Rapaport: And we can use them topically but we are not FDA-approved to inject them.

11:33 Julie Falls: I see. 

11:34 Dr. Vicki Rapaport: So for people who are taking it for hair loss or rejuvenation, it's definitely off label. But topically, even after microchanneling and microneedling I think is fine, as long as it's topical not in a needle.

11:46 Dr. Greg Maguire: Exactly. You don't want to be sub-Q or otherwise injecting these into the body, although people have done that. We've worked with very various physicians in Japan who've had the ability to sub-Q inject these exosomes with good effect, but that's not an approved process. We certainly don't want to do that. We don't advocate that until there's going to be an FDA approval to do that. We have to be conscious of all the laws and regulations and be very careful and safe.

12:21 Trina Renea: I have a question. Like a liposome you put ingredients in to get them into to the skin. With exosomes, you're saying it's like a smart liposome. But isn't it— I mean, are there only one ingredient inside of an exosome and that is a healing molecule or is it you can put anything inside of an exosome? So it depends on what they put in those exosomes whether it's going to be good or not, because everybody's on the market who's like, “I have the best exosomes.” Well, what's inside of them?

12:55 Dr. Greg Maguire: Exactly. It's an array of molecules inside the exosomes. The molecule types that are in the exosome depend upon which cell type is making the exosome. 

What we do with our technology, it's a patented technology, but what we do is we use skin-derived stem cells to make the exosomes. So if you take these, they're classified as a type of adipose mesenchymal stem cell and they're resident in the lower part of the dermis as well as the fat pad under the dermis is where you find these types of mesenchymal stem cells.

So they're resident in the skin. And if you use that type of cell to derive your exosome, and the way you do it is to culture and naturally stimulate your mesenchymal stem cell and then the stem cell will release the exosome. Then you collect the exosome.

And the mesenchymal stem cell will naturally put into the exosomes things like growth factors, immune modulators, heat shock proteins which repair other proteins, antioxidants. So it's a mix of different types of proteins in one exosome. That's kind of cool because these molecules that are natural to the skin, they're there to maintain and heal the skin.

If you think about it, I did a calculation in my book chapter about exosomes. The exosomes we use are roughly 50 to 85 nanometers in diameter. And depending on the size of the proteins, you can have 20,000 proteins in one exosome. And if you think about it, these different types of proteins, the 20,000 proteins in the exosome of different types, penetrate through the skin, go to the target, release all those molecules at the same time in the same space. They act synergistically. 

So it's a release in time and in space of all those 20,000 proteins so they can act synergistically together. It's not one protein going over here and one protein going over here, time zero versus time 10. They're all coming together and act synergistically.

So it's a really beautiful, evolved and developed technology that Mother Nature made for us.

15:49 Trina Renea: So how do you know you're getting a safe product versus a not-safe product? Like how can you trust where these people are getting their exosomes from, what kind of skin they're using? It seems like it's kind of wild out there. Even the people who are selling them don't really know what they're talking about when they're selling them.

16:08 Dr. Greg Maguire: It is wild out there and you have people out there claiming to have exosomes in a product when you know they don't. For example, they'll take a cell extra and that means they're taking a cell and they're chemically and/or physically battering the cell to capture the molecules inside the cell. That means the cell has not made and released the exosomes. You've got an extract where the exosome hasn't been formed and yet they're saying they have exosomes. You have to wait for the cell to release the exosome. The cell will have put all those different molecules in the exosome then release it from the cell.

So you have products out there claiming they have exosomes and they don't. They just have an extract of a bunch of different molecules.

So when we do this, and we published a big safety paper on our technology where we were— and we're doing this towards our FDA approvals where we need to do those safety studies. We wanted to do them anyway but we make sure there's no toxicity, there's no tumorigenesis of the molecules. 

We made sure through Ames test there's no mutagenesis of DNA. We did a human insult patch repeat test where we made sure when these molecules are put on human skin over periods of weeks, there's no irritation.

So there were a bunch of different studies we did in that published paper to make sure the technology is safe. And then there's a vast, vast literature, Vicki, about the mesenchymal stem cell exosomes and all the molecules that are released that we use. There's a vast literature. You can even take these molecules from stem cells that have been derived from cancer patients, and they're perfectly safe. That's good work coming from very good academic laboratories.

But if you derive exosomes and these molecules from other types of stem cells, you can run into trouble. There are some of the good companies using similar technologies, we all use adipose mesenchymal stem cells and fibroblast derived from human skin and it's all done under FDA. 

All of our cells that we use are derived here in California where we have our own Public Health Service. We're actually more stringent here in the state than is the FDA, so everything we do is derived from and done under regulations of FDA and the California State Public Health. But you can— and there's just a few companies doing it, but they'll derive molecules from like bone marrow stem cells. 

People don't realize that, and this company never realized that the bone marrow is the site of all these recycled, recirculated cancer cells and recirculated inflammatory, for example, inflammatory T cells. And they condition the cells in the bone marrow to have inflammatory characteristics and even oncogenic characteristics. So you have to be very careful with the cell type you choose.

And if you look at a number of the companies and the ones that are careful and publish papers about their technology, there's another company here that originated in San Diego. I know the scientists and the dermatologists that created the company and the technology and they just did it like we did. They did a beautiful job to look at the science, the safety, the technology and be very careful with it.

So there's some very good players in the field but, as you said, there's some real charlatans. You now have exosomes coming into the market from overseas and they're what we call lyophilized exosomes. That means those are exosomes that have been freeze-dried. And the freeze-drying procedure actually damages the proteins on the inside of the exosome. 

When you lyophilize the exosome, you also strip off what we call the tethered proteins and polysaccharides. Those are the proteins and complex sugars attached to the outside of the exosome which give it a lot of those smart quality. So if you use a lyophilized exosome product, you're just not going to have the same efficacy. If the proteins are damaged, it's potentially unhealthy because misfolded proteins could be very unhealthy. So you need to stick with people who are very careful.

21:18 Trina Renea: If you're using a bad exosome product, what can you potentially see on your skin will happen? Like when you say it's damaging, what will it do? Will it cause inflammation?

21:32 Dr. Greg Maguire: It can cause inflammation. So some of these, it's not done right. Some of these exosomes can cause inflammation. 

I remind people that if you're using some of these products out on the market that use bone marrow mesenchymal stem cell-derived exosomes or some people are using extracts from platelets, we know that when you have an open wound, bone marrow mesenchymal stem cells and platelets come into the wound to very quickly close that wound and very much fight infection. That's inducing a lot of inflammation. And because the closure is so quickly mediated, you have fibrosis. 

Those cells, those extracts can induce a lot of inflammation, fibrosis and you have to be careful. Because if you use them for a long time, they're potentially oncogenic. 

If you use those for a short time, you might get some inflammation that could help close a wound, for example, but you certainly don't want to do that under normal circumstances and you don't want to use those kind of products for the long term because, again, those platelets and those bone marrow mesenchymal stem cells that come in very transiently into the wound to quickly heal and close the wound and fight that infection.

The skin-derived mesenchymal stem cells and fibroblasts are there to put the immune system into a pro-healing state, bring down inflammation. They're antifibrotic and, actually, they've been found to be anti-oncogenic. 

So, if you're going to use anything long term on the skin, be very careful in your choice of products.

23:23 Dr. Vicki Rapaport: Question about freeze-dried versus not freeze-dried, does that mean the one ones that are refrigerated are potentially safer? Because I think the ones that are freeze-dried are typically not refrigerated, or is that incorrect?

23:36 Dr. Greg Maguire: Yeah, it's true. The freeze drying is a convenience for the company, because when we do it we have the fresh— what's released from the stem cells, and it's a liquid and it's fresh. And we keep it in the refrigerator until we put it into a product and it goes out on the market. And the exosomes are very stable. They last a long time. So it's a product that will stay on the shelf for a long time.

But when you freeze-dry the exosomes, you're taking all of that liquid and you're condensing it down into a very small pellet and then you can easily store that on the shelf without refrigeration. You can ship it cheaply across the planet. So it's convenient for the company but it's not as efficacious by far.

24:25 Dr. Vicki Rapaport: Okay. So a product on the shelf, an exosome serum, cleanser, moisturizer, whatever, something in a skincare product that is not refrigerated most likely doesn't have much exosomal activity.

24:41 Dr. Greg Maguire: Well, it can. If you take the fresh exosomes and you don't lyophilize them, these exosomes— and I go through this very much in detail in my book chapter, but these exosomes withstand high temperatures. 

You think about it. The exosome is made, it's evolved and developed to work in the human body at temperatures of even above 98 degrees Fahrenheit. They've evolved to work in various pHs so they'll stay intact. pH is from down to 2 in the gut yet you see exosomes intact in the gut and the work pH is above 8. So they're very robust.

As long as you don't lyophilize them or otherwise perturb them, like when I'm mixing them in the laboratory, I have to be careful not to what we call ‘shear’ them. The propeller in my mixer has to be a special propeller, special rotational speed RPM so I don't shear them and break them apart.

So you have to be very careful with them. If you are, they'll last for a long time in the bottle on the shelf. I've had product with me— I just bring product home or in the laboratory and I watch it, test it for a period of five years, and it won't last five years. But it will last one or two years if you don't freeze it, if you don't take it out into the Arizona desert on a hot day and just leave it baking in the sun. You'll be fine.

They're robust. That's part of the beauty of the exosome, they're very robust, very protective of what's inside the exosome.

26:40 Trina Renea: So when you're using a good exosome product that is coming from a reputable company like yours, NeoGenesis, what can you expect to see on your skin? Why would somebody use these? Just a normal person.

27:02 Dr. Greg Maguire: Yeah, it's remarkable what the technology will do for you. We have people that use the product for eczema, atopic dermatitis, for aging skin, for wound healing.

27:23 Trina Renea: Rosacea too?

27:25 Dr. Greg Maguire: Rosacea, anywhere where you have an abnormal, like an autoimmunity or an abnormal immune response. The molecules really do adjust, for those that know, you know, the macrophages and the innate immune system and the T cells and the adaptive immune system they can be pro-inflammatory, those cells, or they can be anti-inflammatory, pro-repair. And so these molecules from the stem cells and the fibroblasts that we use modulate both the macrophages and the T cells to go into an anti-inflammatory, pro-repair state.

I have a couple of papers on that, if anyone's interested. And this is why, interestingly, the technology works on many different types of skin conditions because we're renormalizing the physiology of the skin. We're just putting back into the skin what was there when the skin was young and healthy. So you do see some positive benefit in a lot of different skin conditions.

For example, with the hair product. I just topically apply it on my hair. You know, I'm aging. I'm up there. My professorship dates back to the ‘80s and ‘90s and I was really graying up here and losing hair. I started using it and just topically applying and the hair starts coming back in. Actually, you repigment because the stem cell type we use in the hair, there's a dermal papilla-type fibroblast stem cell in there that also helps repigmentation.

So it's renormalizing…

29:20 Trina Renea: How quickly does that work?

29:22 Dr. Greg Maguire: Pardon?

29:24 Dr. Vicki Rapaport: Trina was asking how quickly does that work for hair loss or graying hair. It sounds impressive.

29:29 Trina Renea: Like with pigmentation, pigment in hair.

29:33 Dr. Greg Maguire: It takes a while. So depending on your condition and your age and so forth, some people will see positive results beginning in four to six weeks. Because I still have a pretty healthy scalp, I began to see hair sprouting in and pigmentation returning in about four to five weeks after I started using it. It's noticeable.

For some people, it'll take a little longer. And then some people have, and we've published on it, some people will use the technology topically with, as you mentioned before, microneedling so that can also benefit regrowing hair.

We've had women who do bleach blonde. They have beautiful bleach blond hair and they'll start using the product and growing in. They said, “Oh, my goodness. I don't need to bleach the hair, because I bleach it because I was going gray. And now I've got my dark hair again.” So they're kind of astounded.

That can happen in a lot of people. It depends on the condition of your scalp and the type of alopecia you're dealing with. 

30:49 Trina Renea: So would you say that young, like if someone was interested in an exosome product that's going to be for people— because most people I think a part of aging is inflammation in the skin. So it's going to help with inflammation under the skin, repair of cells under the skin, also, really great maybe after like a laser or some kind of a treatment in a doctor's office to repair the skin more rapidly? Is that why people use exosomes for that?

31:22 Dr. Greg Maguire: Yes, it's beautiful in combination with best practices in your doctor's office. We have everything from laser physicians, we have a buddy who's a surgeon. He does a lot of scalpel surgery and he uses our technology before and after the surgery, the scalpel surgery, and sees really beautiful, positive results, bettering his surgical technique. 

So the laser, you can see the benefit very quickly upon using the product. You'll see reduced redness. People get back out to work much more quickly if they've had an aggressive procedure. And then the procedure itself has better outcome.

So it's really nicely used in conjunction with best practices in various doctor's offices. And we see a lot of that.

We also use this technology. We do a lot of work and without payment, helping especially women going through— we've been working with various organizations women going through breast cancer treatment. So whether it's chemo and/or radiation, we've been able to— we started off remediating radiation dermatitis very effectively. 

We had someone come in working with her esthetician oncologist. She was having to stop her radiation treatment because the skin was so bad, it was life-threatening. The skin was so bad. She was turned onto by one of our people we work with in Boston and so she started using the product and got herself back into treatment pretty quickly.

Then they wanted to start using product before the radiation treatment and we've found that we can very much prevent radiation dermatitis. So the prevention is something we'd really like to work on so people don't have to go through that awful radiation dermatitis.

33:35 Dr. Vicki Rapaport: Well, it's impressive. Exosome for wound healing is very impressive, like if you do— there are a lot of split face case studies of ablative lasers or microneedling, microchanneling. One half of the face use exosomes. Used to be PRP, now it's exosomes. Of course that side that has the exosomes has healed much, much, much faster.

And it's amazing you mentioned radiation dermatitis. It's a huge problem. Anything on the skin, but then think about all the stuff that's happening internally that we have no idea. We cannot see. Maybe there's going to be an application for exosomes internally someday but it's in its early stages. It's very exciting. We just don't really know that much, so we totally appreciate your expertise and your lab continuing to do the research because, hopefully, you're going to keep us healthy and young forever in the next 5 to 10, 20 years when all this stuff comes out, right?

34:28 Dr. Greg Maguire: We're doing our best. And I'll remind everyone, this was really taught to us by a dermatologist, an academic dermatologist up at University of California San Francisco that when you induce, if you just strip the outer layer the epidermis of the skin, you'll induce inflammation in the skin. But the dermatologist looked in the blood they saw that inflammation translated to the blood.

Then when they repaired the outer layer, the epidermis, reduced the inflammation, they looked at the blood, the inflammation was reduced in the blood. So I love to remind people that taking care of your skin as you age is critical to overall inflammation in the body. I mean, that was beautiful work. Peter Elias, I think it was, and some of his colleagues showed that for us. I just love to remind people to take care of that skin. Inflammation there translates to whole body inflammation to some degree.

35:30 Dr. Vicki Rapaport: And that's why we recommend people with eczema and super severe dry skin wear moisturizer, because that's chronic inflammation all the time. So, yes, I agree with you 100%.

35:42 Trina Renea: Do you think using the exosomes is something that someone like me could use every day all the time? Like, it's never too much to get? Or should you use exosomes for like 3 months and then use a bottle of it and then go off of it or is it just a continued use with yours?

36:08 Dr. Greg Maguire: It would be it would be a continued use. What I like to recommend, if people have an affliction and they need to really tamp down inflammation, for example, you may want to use the product two, three and even four times daily. And you don't want be dripping this stuff on. Just a little bit, a light dose.

But then over time, you can titrate the dose down, whereas you may be using it once a day. And doing so is perfectly safe. It's skin-identical molecules that you're using. You just don't want to use too much because then you're wasting your money.

36:49 Trina Renea: Right. Like, if somebody's having a rosacea flare, they could use the exosomes two or three times a day to fix it quicker and then just go back to once a day or something?

37:04 Dr. Greg Maguire: Yes, yes. It depends on the individual. They'll often find their own dosing schedule. We have recommended dosing schedules based on the evidence we have over the years, but a lot of times working with their professionals they'll find, “Here's my optimal dosing strategy,” and, like you said, it may be three or four times initially for a few days and then bring it down to once or twice a day, maybe eventually down to once a day. But it is individual.

37:36 Trina Renea: I love this technology. I think it's fascinating and exciting. I just want our listeners to know to find it from a reputable source for sure and don't just buy off the internet for some cheap exosomes, right?

37:55 Dr. Greg Maguire: Right. There's a couple of really good companies out there and they're scientists and dermatologists working together. They know what they're doing. They're going to take good care of you. Just look for those established reputable companies.

38:14 Trina Renea: Yes, and if you guys are interested in hearing about Dr. Maguire's exosomes, we’ll put a link to his website and his information in our show notes for you so you can look him up and find his exosomes. We brought him on because he is a super expert in this field and so I trust things coming out of his office.

38:44 Julie Falls: That reminds me. If somebody wanted to just try one of your products, because there's so many different— like, is there a starter product that you would recommend just to kick off your exosomes journey?

38:59 Dr. Greg Maguire: Yeah. I would say if you want to try the technology, try either the Recovery or the Skin Serum. They both feature the exosome technologies called our S2RM technology, because it's the molecules derived from two or more stem cell types. But the Skin Serum or the Recovery. 

The Recovery has more concentration of these molecules. So if you're dealing with some sort of skin condition, you might want to really start with that Recovery and see how it works for you.

If you are just beginning to age and see some inflammation in the skin, maybe some lines and wrinkles, you may want to try the Skin Serum and see how that works for you. It's a little bit lesser cost and has a little bit less of the molecules in it. It still has great benefit to the skin.

So, it depends on the individual again.

39:55 Julie Falls: Great. Thank you.

39:58 Trina Renea: Thank you for your information on exosomes. And as this industry grows and grows, we would love to talk to you again in the future and see how things are moving along.

40:09 Dr. Greg Maguire: A lot of research on exosomes and these other molecules that the stem cells secrete, so I'm studying it every day and working on it every day. As you can tell, I love talking about it, sharing the information as best I can.

40:25 Julie Falls: Thank you for sharing.

40:25 Dr. Vicki Rapaport: And when we talk to you next time, you're going to look 45 years younger. Is that what's happening? And your hair is going to be dark and like super long, like a rock star. And I'm going to look like I'm 14.

40:37 Trina Renea: Me too.

40:39 Dr. Vicki Rapaport: You already do.

40:40 Trina Renea: I want it in my hair. If a woman is just aging, like myself, and my hair is thinning, can you rub exosomes in your scalp and will it help an aging woman's thinning hair grow back?

40:58 Dr. Greg Maguire: It usually does. 

40:59 Julie Falls: Yes, he has a hair product. 

41:00 Dr. Greg Maguire: Yeah, we've had very few instances of women reporting that it didn't work for them.

41:08 Trina Renea: Is that like Rogaine? 

41:10 Dr. Greg Maguire: No, it works through different mechanisms.

41:14 Dr. Vicki Rapaport: We just went through an hour…

41:16 Trina Renea: No, but I know it's a different technique. What I mean by is it like Rogaine, like you put a serum, you rub it into your scalp daily.

41:27 Dr. Greg Maguire: You do. Daily. And it's best to, as best you can, not put it on the dead hair shaft but get it onto the scalp, get it onto the skin, get it into the follicle. 

If you are showering or you otherwise have wet, damp hair, that's a good time to apply it. If not, just be careful. It's in a dropper bottle, so you just drop it and just kind of rub it into the scalp and to those areas where you need it. So it is like Rogaine in that sense. Just topically apply it, try as best you can to get it onto the scalp not absorbing into dead hair shaft.

42:10 Trina Renea: Right. That's hard to do.

42:12 Dr. Greg Maguire: It is, and that's why we say it's like I'll apply it to myself when I come out of the shower. So I'll lightly dry my hair if I shampooed it, lightly dry my hair so it's still damp, then apply. Let it soak in and then I'll finish drying my hair, if I remember to do that. but that way you're not getting so much of the product on the hair shaft.

Even if you do it with dry hair, people see great results, just be careful to drop it in on the scalp.

42:45 Trina Renea: All right. Well, thank you so much for sharing this information. Does anyone else have any more questions or do you have anything else you want to tell the audience?

42:57 Dr. Greg Maguire: Yeah, I would just say the technology is even more complex than the exosomes themselves. So we're very careful to use all the molecules that the stem cells release. Most of the molecules are in the exosomes but some very important molecules are not inside the exosomes. That's why we don't just use exosomes. We use the exosomes plus the molecules that are around the exosomes. And there's some very, very critical molecules in what we call the soluble fraction as well.

So, it's a combination of exosomes and the soluble factors, and there's cool stuff about that too which maybe we can talk about another time.

43:45 Trina Renea: All right.

43:47 Dr. Vicki Rapaport: To be continued, for sure. 

43:47 Trina Renea: Yes, very good information.

43:48 Dr. Vicki Rapaport: Thank you so much.

43:50 Julie Falls: Thank you so much.

43:52 Dr. Greg Maguire: Thank you for the invite. It's just a pleasure to be with such a curious and educated group and teachers, like I am teaching a lot of people. So thank you for your efforts and educating your audience. This is great.

44:08 Dr. Vicki Rapaport: Thank you, Dr. Maguire.

44:10 Trina Renea: Thank you very much.

44:11 Dr. Vicki Rapaport: Have a lovely rest of your day.

44:12 Trina Renea: And again, we'll let everybody know in the show notes how to reach him and get to his website, if you're interested in more information. It's a wealth of knowledge, a lot of information in his website that talks all about exosomes, so we will let you know soon.

Thanks for joining us once again, everybody. Have a wonderful day. 

44:36 Dr. Vicki Rapaport: Goodbye.

44:37 Dr. Greg Maguire: Thank you. 

44:38 Trina Renea: Bye, Dr. Maguire.

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